Welcome to the Effortless Swimming Podcast to show that help swimmers and triathletes love the water, become a better swimmer and live a better life. Here’s your host, Brenton Ford. Welcome to the Effortless Swimming Podcast. I’ve got a returning guest on today. I’ve got Taryn Richardson from Dietician Approved. Welcome back to the podcast. Ah, thank you so much for having me. You’re on episode number 260 where we’re talking about fueling for performance and avoiding late night sugar binges. Today we’re going to go through some different things on this episode. So whether you’re a triathlete or a swimmer, this information is going to be relevant to you. It’s going to help you improve your performance still, I would hope. But also just covering some of the misconceptions about diet and nutrition because you talk to 10 different experts and there’s probably 10 different opinions there. So we want to try and get to the fundamentals of what is going to help someone recover well, perform well and make the most of their training.

Because I see so many athletes who are putting the time in with their training. But if they’re not fueling themselves correctly, then they’re not going to be able to recover well for the next session. They’re not going to be able to do their best at those sessions and then really for race day, which is what a lot of the triathletes are working towards. So looking forward to covering a lot of those topics on this episode. So Taryn, the first thing I want to ask about is protein. Now this is a little bit of a selfish question because I’ve started going to the gym more consistently. And I’m more aware of the protein intake that I feel like I need. So to start off with, let’s talk about protein, how much should people be having? What are some good sources and some not so good sources of it? And for someone like me who’s going to the gym three times a week, while also swimming three to four times a week.

How important is the role of protein in a diet like mine? Yeah, great question. I love that you always ask the selfish, selfish questions as well. Like you straight into how do you help me? Just a case study. That’s all it is. So yeah, protein is definitely really important. It’s one of the, like it is the building block of life. And we often associate protein with muscles, but protein is literally the building block for everything in our body. Like all of our hormones, our enzymes, our cells, like everything we are built on is protein. So we need to get enough, but there I guess is a lot of maybe bro science in the gym scene where people are thinking more is better and more is not better with protein. It’s very clearly established in the research that we need like certain amounts for certain things. Strength training being one of the highest and then particularly somebody new to strength training is another kind of spike in your requirements.

If you haven’t done any and then you suddenly start lifting and tearing your muscle fibers, then your needs are going to be higher. But I like to talk about protein like it was a cup. And so you want to fill that cup regularly right throughout the day. So breakfast, lunch, dinner, maybe even drip some in for snacks. But if you’re over feeling that cup, it kind of just spills out and it is excess to what we can use at that time. And it does get wasted. So we will use the calories for energy, but any excess can’t be stored. Like we store carbohydrate in our muscles and our liver and we store fat as fat, unfortunately. But protein doesn’t have a storage facility or a reservoir where we can keep it for later. So we take what we need at the time and then we break it down and we pee it out. So we just make it expensive urine if we are overdoing our protein in an occasion of eating. And then the reverse of that is if we’re under feeling it, we’re not doing the best job we can to maximize all of our recovery and muscle protein synthesis pathways.

So we’re not doing the best job to recover or back up and go again or get those adaptations that we’re looking for out of the training sessions that we’re doing. So it’s about finding your sweet spot and it depends what sort of athlete you are and what type of training that you’re doing. But particularly in that window after exercise is a really key one where our body is just searching for all of those building blocks. And you want to give it the right amount of protein there in the right time frame. But working with triathletes, that’s my area of expertise. They are constantly training, right? We don’t have one to two days to rest and recover before you do your next training session. Most triathletes train once, twice, sometimes three times a day. And it’s rare for them to have a complete off rest day. Like there’s often a lighter, easy recovery session on a day that’s maybe just a 30 minute run or, you know, an easy 3K swim is still exercising, but it’s not really hard and high intensity.

So we don’t have the luxury of time to sit back and watch Netflix and put our feet up and recover. So we need to be really on top of what we do, particularly after exercise. But for the 24 to 48 hours after a session, you need to be focusing on putting protein back in the system to recover properly. So in terms of the amount after session, it’s going to change. But is there a rule of thumb that you’d often go by for someone and then in terms of that window with, I don’t know if this is right. But in terms of refuelling with carbs, you hear about that 30 minute window after exercise. Is there something like that for protein intake? Yeah. So I would say 30 minutes is a good kind of target. It depends with lots of things with nutrition. I always say it depends. I honestly need to get it printed on a t-shirt because there’s no one size fits all with nutrition. But 30 minutes is a good target because we know that all of the hormones and enzymes for recovery peak at about 60 minutes post exercise.

So we want those building blocks of the amino acids from our protein foods that have been broken down and digested in our stomach to be in our bloodstream to meet that peak at 60 minutes so that we’ve got everything that we need to do the best job of our recovery as possible. So if you’re sucking back amino acids, you could do that in 45 minutes like post exercise. But if you’re eating, which is more ideal, having real food there rather than just a pill or a powder, then give it some time to go through that whole digestion process and pull those molecules apart so that they are single units and available for use in the bloodstream. Let’s talk about some sources of protein. What are some sources that you see people using that you guard? You’ve probably got a better option there. And what are some real high quality ones that you would recommend? Yeah, so most people think about protein after exercise and go straight for a protein powder.

But like I said, right in the beginning, your protein needs are like a cup and want to get that amount like that sweet spot right for you. And often supplements and powders will overdo it for people. So you are just kind of making expensive pee in a way. And it’s so easy to get your protein needs from food out of all of the macronutrients and all of the nutrients in our diet protein would have to be the easiest because it is readily available in all of our meats. So red meat, chicken, fish, any sort of animal meat, you can get protein from eggs and they’re actually a great source. You just need enough. Most people eat like one or two eggs and like, yep, protein done, but you need more like three or four if that’s your only source. You also get protein from all of your dairy foods. So milk, yogurt, cheese and go for things like the high protein yogurt. So things like Chobani or Yopro. If you’re in Australia or like Farje and there’s lots of other different brands depending on where you are in the world.

They are more strained. So they’ve like run them through filtration processes more times, kind of like the difference between a whey protein concentrate and a whey protein isolate. It goes through extra filters to get the protein out primarily. How are we going? So we’ve got meats, we’ve got eggs, we’ve got dairy. If you’re a plant-based athlete, you’re getting protein from things like tofu and it’s fermented cousin tempeh and all of your legumes. So chickpeas, lentils, baked beans, those types of legumes as well as nuts and seeds. So it’s really easy to get enough protein even as a vegan athlete. You just need to know like where your sources are coming from, combining a few different types if you are relying on entirely plant-based sources. So you’ve got that full complement of amino acids that we don’t get from plant-based protein sources that you do get from animal. We call that high biological value because our animal sources of protein contain all of those essential amino acids that our body can’t produce

that don’t exist, that complement doesn’t exist in a single plant-based protein. So you just have to combine lots across the day so that you are getting all of those amino acids that you need. Excellent. Excellent. So in terms of daily intake, the general rule of thumb I’ve heard there is almost for kilos, it’s roughly double what you’d weigh in kilos in terms of grams. So if I weigh 80 kilos, 160 grams of… So 2 grams per kilo? Yeah. Is that…? Yeah, so it depends. For a sedentary person in the population, which is not us, it’s like 0.8 to 1 gram per kilo is a general guideline. But then there’s literature in upwards of like 3.6 grams per kilo as well. So again, it’s just depending on who it is. Like, are we talking about, you know, maybe yourself as a case study for this episode who, you know, you’re well trained, right? You’re fit, you’re active, but you’ve newly started strength training. So that would be a time where it might peak to 2 grams per kilo.

Maybe it’s even 2.5, whereas somebody that consistently does strength training all the time, like maybe it is somewhere around 1.5 to 2. But like I said, more is not better. So they have done research around, like, are you getting better strength gains? Are you getting that hypertrophy, which is size, muscle size? You’re not going to do that as an endurance athlete anyway. But, you know, the gym junkies do want that size. Are you growing as well as another thing to consider? Are you an adolescence athlete that has got to manage training load as well as the demands of growth? Are you repairing from some sort of injury or surgery? You need to go up there as well. So I guess it depends who you’re talking to. But, you know, 2 grams per kilo is a good kind of stab at the dark somewhere in the middle that you can’t go too wrong with. Yeah, yeah, that’s really helpful. I’ll tell you what I mean having for breakfast lately.

And our overseas audience might listen to this and think this is almost a sin as an Australian. But like I’ll often, I’ll train in the morning and then I’ll come back. I’ll have a snack in the car and away home. But then I’ll cook kangaroo meat. And now you can get this from your local supermarket here in Australia. But if you’re listening from overseas, you think, well, it sounds pretty mean to be eating kangaroo. But yeah, great, great, great red meat tastes. I think the taste is really good. So I’ve been having that consistently for breakfast with some other things as well. But I’ve found that to be, that keeps me fairly full throughout the day. And just to be a good option for breakfast for me because I’ve got the time to cook it here and quite enjoy it. So I just want to put that out there. Kangaroo meat or mince is actually leaner compared to beef. So less fat and it’s actually higher in protein too compared to beef.

So a good choice. I’ll take that. Probably not available over in the US or UK though. Although maybe Whole Foods probably has it. They’re probably onto it. I wouldn’t do it every day either because we don’t want to have much more than about 500 grams of red meat in a week. It is linked to bowel cancer. And so the World Health Organization maybe 10 years ago now brought out some guidelines around red meat intake. So just make sure you’re not doing that seven days a week and you have got some variety in that. It is, yeah, like I said, good lean sauce. But we do want to be mindful that we’re not just like as Australians as a population, we overeat red meat in a big way. Especially on Grand Final weekend. That’s right. When most people have a barbecue or something along those lines. Yeah. And steaks come from, you know, a steak restaurant and they’re like 450 grams, right? That’s it for the week in a way. This episode of the podcast is proudly brought to you by our sponsor, form smart swim goggles.

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I don’t want to think about that. That’s hitting my quota too early. Let’s talk about meal prep. What can people do to save themselves time cooking? Because many people are very time time poor. So what can they do to get ahead of that each week? And what are some things that you’d recommend there just being able to be ready for dinners each night? Because when I was coaching in my early early twenties, I would train it from four till six. And I’d swim about six K’s was a pretty hard session. And then I would not eat much at all. Maybe I might have an apple or a banana. And then I would go to the pool and coach for an hour and a half to be on deck. And then I’d finally make my way home. And I was ravenous by then. And so they would never, I never ate anything good after that because I just wasn’t, wasn’t prepared. So I think meal prep is a really important thing to have that organized. So what can we do to get ahead of that and make sure that we’re eating good foods and to save time as well?

Yeah, it’s just about setting yourself up for success, not failure, right? And that is very common for athletes to not have food sorted, particularly in the evenings. And that is one of the key times where you want to be making sure you’re ticking all of your recovery boxes within that 30 minute time frame after after your session. So when you get out of the pool, if you smash some food there that hit all of your recovery targets and then maybe even had like a second dinner before you went to bed or another protein hit or a little snack there. That would have set you up for success so much better because you’ve delayed your recovery. And then are you kind of getting up the next morning and jumping in the pool again or doing some sort of training session? Sometimes I would. Other times I was back coaching. I mean, these days I’ll train three mornings a week in the pool. The other mornings I’ll run or go to the gym the next morning.

So I’m not often training at night unless it’s maybe a gym session. Yeah. And most triathletes will do a session like that. They’ll train in the evening and then back up and train again in the morning. So when your window of opportunity to recover is tight like that, it’s, you know, eight hours. Then we need to be really diligent about what we’re doing after that session in the evening. So it’s just about looking after future. Like I’m a total food nerd and I love this whole organisational piece. I’ve actually built a whole menu planning system for people to help them and have a recipe database with now it’s got 200 recipes in there that I’ve developed over the years. You need to think ahead about what your week looks like and you can do that in any way that you like. Like write it down on a piece of paper, check it on the fridge. Like you will know what your training is. You need to go, all right, what are the nights where I need to come home and, you know,

food is on the table or it’s in the microwave and I’m literally reheating it and I’m getting my recovery nutrition in within that 30-minute window. Or, hey, I’ve got to take food with me because I’m not going to get home in time to eat what I need in that time point. So look ahead to those nights and they’re the nights you need to plan leftovers or you’re batch cooking on the weekend and you’re stuffing stuff in the freezer so that all you have to do is microwave it and, you know, job done. So the first thing is to look at ahead at that so that you’re not being really reactive with your nutrition. You’ve got to be proactive and get yourself on the front foot. And what I say, like I call it looking after future you, whatever you can do, instead of, you know, sitting down and binging Netflix for two hours on a Sunday, spend that time getting yourself prepped for the week and that’ll really set you up for success

and help you back up and recover so much faster if you can do that. And the other thing that I think is really key is having a plan for the week, right? So that’s just dinners. What are you eating for the week and shop once so that you’re not running back and forth to the supermarket constantly, like getting home from a session and going, oh man, what’s for dinner? I’ve got to go get something like we want to avoid that full stop. So make a plan for the week ahead. I’ve got a template that people can grab if they want to use that. It’s free at dietitianapproved.com forward slash menu planning. Map out your training map out like the food that you’re going to have, the recipes that you’re going to make shop once a week. It’ll save you so much time if you can do that and do whatever cooking you can on your weekends or your days off to put some stuff away or put some stuff in your freezer. And you don’t have to spend like six hours on your feet doing that.

Nobody wants to do that. But every time you cook something, just double it. So you’ve got a second batch for future you, whether it’s in the fridge or the freezer. And then once you’ve done that for a month or two, you’ll have a few different options ready to go. So you have that variety. Yeah, that’s it’s the way to go. Just be prepared at my kids on a Wednesday night. I’ve got young kids and we’ve now started meal planning that what they’re going to eat on the way home from their swim lessons. Because if we don’t feed them on the car ride home, they have feral and they’re hitting each other and they’re just they’re losing it. And it’s like, well, okay, I can understand on the same if I don’t eat straight away after swimming on. Yeah, I’m not feeling the best either. So put like a chicken wrap thing that we’ve made for them in there. And it’s made a huge, huge difference. So kids and adults are not too dissimilar when it comes to comes to that.

So adults are just a tiny bit better at managing those emotions, but we still feel that rubbish. Yeah, exactly. We absolutely do. Now I want to talk about some of the common things that you’ve seen lately with the triathletes that you’re working with. What are some of the common mistakes that that you see them running into and where they may be spending time where it’s not required? Maybe they’re spending money on things that they don’t need to. Is there anything that’s that’s popped up recently for you? Oh, there’s heaps. Honestly, how long have we got? I think in your intro, like you even said, like a lot of people get their nutrition advice from the wrong place. And I’m really passionate about teaching athletes like the right way to do things from an evidence based perspective. You need to really check your sources when it comes to nutrition because there is so much rubbish on the Internet. I get so frustrated seeing articles in like triathlon 220 and triathlete magazine and you look at the byline and they’ve written by like just an average punter.

Like not even an nutrition expert. So sorry, I’ll calm down. I get really like my blood boils when I talk about it. So make sure you’re getting nutrition advice from somebody that’s qualified to give it would be the first one. But I think triathletes in particular or maybe just endurance athletes, they don’t focus on the big rocks when it comes to nutrition. They love to do the little one percenters and the shiny objects and all those things first before actually focusing on some of the key things that will actually push the needle to make them better athletes. So I always talk about nutrition being the fourth leg of a triathlon. You’ve got a swim bike run and you then have to work on your nutrition like relatively quickly. It is one of the big rocks to your success as a triathlete as well as sleep and recovery. But we don’t do those things very well. We like to burn the candle at both ends and you know, like you like not eat and then expect your body to be a high performing engine.

But it’s just like putting the cheap economy fuel in and hoping for the best. So I think we need to take a step back and do the not so sexy things first and do them really well, like, you know, getting enough protein, making sure you have your carbohydrate intake right for you. And it’s very specific to where you’re at and in your journey, what type of training you’re doing, all those sorts of things. And doing things like eating enough fruits and vegetables. It’s not very sexy, but I don’t know. You were taking a random like greens powder to do that, but really just need to eat some bloody fruits and vegetables. Yeah. Hey, still a sore point. No. Have you stopped taking that yet? No, I don’t I don’t buy it anymore. I don’t and they and they approached me to sponsor the podcast as well. What would town say? No, I will not be sponsored by any supplement company, just like from a moral perspective, because I want you to know that if I recommend something, it’s because it’s good, not because I’m getting picked backs to suggest that you should do that.

And you should definitely not take a vitamin supplement powder thing, because we have no idea what’s in it. Nobody’s batch testing them to go. Are all those nutrients from those fruits and vegetables still there when we’ve manufactured it heavily in a plant in like a factory or not? Because there’s no way to know unless they batch test it. So hopefully you’re not still like throwing 80 bucks a month at this stuff. Come on, Brenton, you’re better than that. I’m not. I’m not. And one of the and when I looked into it and they don’t, they don’t say what’s in it. They say like a few things that’s in it. They don’t say the percentages and that kind of thing. And to me that that was a red flag to me going, OK, well, if you’re not going to say, I understand that if you put how much of. Spirulina’s in it, whatever else they’ve gotten there, that that’s kind of the secret source. And that’s why you’re not saying those percentages.

But to me that was. Spirulina’s not secret. It’s not secret. It’s not a secret source. No, but it’s the it’s not saying the what’s actually in it. That kind of allows them to, you know, get away with it, I guess. Yeah, it’s like a proprietary blend type thing. That’s like a dead giveaway that you should probably avoid it if they’re not being that open and honest about, yeah, what it is. Yeah. So we’ve talked about so getting the fundamentals right. The same thing applies in in swimming. It’s just do do the basics and do them well. The elite swimmers, they’re really good at the basics so we don’t need to be overly fancy there. So if you can hold a good body line, if you can kick well, if you can rotate the right amount just doing doing the basics. Like it’s going to get you along a long way. Same with the with nutrition. What else are you saying that where people are getting sidetracked? Yeah, so I guess like if they’re not doing the fundamentals, it’s the shiny objects that they get definitely way laid and sidetracked by.

There’s quite a few things going on in in the endurance space at the moment like continuous glucose monitoring kind of been going off this year. And that is definitely like a bit of a shiny object to be honest. We don’t really know about its application in sport yet. I’ve got Greg Cox on my podcast coming up in about a month’s time at the start of November to talk about continuous glucose monitoring and what we know so far in its application to sport because it’s been around for a long time. Diabetics have been using it for a very long time and it’s only now that people are starting to get interested in it in terms of the use in sport. It’s being marketed as a fuel gauge, but it’s really hard to translate what’s going on in your interstitial fluid to what’s happening at that muscle level. So I don’t think we have time to dive into that today, but definitely go and listen to that episode on the Triathlon Intuition Academy podcast when it drops.

It’ll be episode 118 coming out in the first week of November. Coxie is a co-author on the latest paper with which summarizes what we know so far. There is only six research studies to date, more coming in the works, but six so far that have given us some information around whether it is useful in sport or not. So that one’s definitely something that I wouldn’t waste any money on at this point, particularly if you’re not eating enough fruits and vegetables. Do those big rocks first because it’s not the marketing messages that are on the main websites for the companies that are trying to promote that. And we saw a lot of athletes wearing them in Kona that don’t wear them now. It was just a marketing strategy for that company. So yeah, keep your wits about you with things like that and other supplements that we know aren’t particularly safe or effective. Spend your money doing some milk prepping and batch cooking rather than wasting it and throwing it down the drain on things that aren’t particularly useful.

Let’s talk about carb phobia. I read a post that Sam Long put out today talking about how many carbs he took in in his last race or was it world champs. I can’t remember exactly which one it was, but it was either 140 or 160 grams an hour, maybe 140 grams an hour. That’s a lot. Yeah, but he required racing and he was talking about that, which is obviously a lot more than what a lot of other people have maybe mentioned in the past. So I found that quite interesting and that’s certainly not being carb phobic. That would be the opposite. Yeah. Let’s talk about where that comes from and the downside to not having enough carbs to use and burn when you’re racing and when you’re training. Yeah. So I think Sam’s an interesting example. Right. And he is a well oiled machine. Like he’s super efficient. He does a race in way shorter duration than your eye could or most people listening. I would suggest also. And so that amount of carbohydrate intake is not something that like everybody should go and try or go and aspire to because you’re not going that fast.

You’re not that good at using carbohydrate in the first place. And, you know, that probably still doesn’t meet his needs. Our rate limiting step is still our guts. But anyway, topic of conversation for another day. Most triathletes, to be honest, I spend the whole first phase of the triathlon nutrition academy program. I spend like 12 weeks trying to beat out the carb phobia mindset from them. It comes from probably from the 80s where carbs were bad. Fat was bad. So people just didn’t eat fat and didn’t eat carbs. But as an endurance athlete, you need to start to switch your thinking into more performance and feeling for performance because your carbohydrate needs are individual to you. And your training volume, they’re not the same as somebody that sits on their butt all day at work at a computer and drives a desk. So we need to just think a bit more strategically around carbs. Like the message is not eat more carbs because that’s also not helpful for people.

But just understanding how much to have and when releases like so much stress and anxiety from people when they have a clear plan around how to do that. Like how much do you need pre-training? How much do you need post-training? How much do you then need across different meals based on your training demand? So I’m really passionate about teaching triathletes how to periodize their carbohydrate. So we’re not doing the same thing all the time. And we’re fueling for lighter recovery days very differently to those like big longer endurance four, five, six hour ride days. And they should look different from a carbohydrate perspective, but it does take a little bit of a mindset shift to get that in your head. And honestly, the only one day of that fueling properly away from going, oh, that’s that’s how it’s meant to feel. Like I’m not meant to be shattered for the entire rest of the day after this ride and rendered useless and risking divorce.

Or I got an email from a client this morning saying, I’ve been trying to force my five year old to have a nap with me. But now I don’t need to do that anymore because I’ve got enough carbohydrate on board for those sessions. So it’s just about thinking differently about carbs. The message is not no carbs or all the carbs. It’s just being a bit more strategic around your fueling and building that up over time as well. So you don’t want to go from not having much to then having a crap load because your body doesn’t know how to deal with it. So we need to sort of slowly build our way up and that should also build with training volume as you head into a race. And then it can drop down again after your race is done. You’re not doing as much training volume too. So periodization is like a really good word to describe that is that we’re not doing the same thing all the time. We’re actually fueling for the work required.

And do you think a large part of that stems from lighter is better? You’ve got to be lighter to go faster on the bike. Is that where it comes from? Like carbs always have been blamed. You know, carbs equal fat, but they don’t really because carbohydrate is four calories per gram and protein is four calories per gram. So cutting out carbohydrate, people tend to increase their protein intake and that doesn’t really change your overall energy intake. So they definitely got blamed. But I guess back in like Sydney 2000 Olympics from then to now, he’s in a huge shift in the body composition of triathletes. Like back then the message was lighter, leaner, faster. And there’s just a whole heap of stress fractures and injuries and people getting sick and like females not having menstrual cycles and things like that. And the dynamics of our body composition for the sport have completely changed and we need to make sure we are strong and robust, particularly on the bike.

And then when you get off and run, you need to not be fatigued for as long as you can over hopefully till like after you’ve crossed the finish line and you need strength for that. So carbs are not going to be what makes you leaner. Cutting them out is not what’s going to make you leaner. You just need to eat properly and eat less crap and probably drink less alcohol, eat more fruits and vegetables. You know, there’s big rocks and scale your carbohydrates up and down. Well, Taryn, I appreciate the coming back on the podcast to talk about this stuff. You’ve answered many of the questions I’ve had for myself and then hopefully someone listening as well. You’re welcome anytime. What have you got coming up that you’re looking forward to looking forward to with the stuff that you’re doing with the nutrition Academy and the athletes that you’re working with? There’s so many things in the pipeline always.

I am a bit of an overachiever. I’m not sure you’re probably the same, right? Just try and do all the things and bite off more than you can chew and then chew really hard. I am opening doors to the Triathlon Nutrition Academy program again in January. Around the 15th of Jan, so mid-Jan if anybody is listening and wants some help with their nutrition, go to dietitianapproved.com forward slash academy to learn more about that. But upcoming this month, I’m running a bike fuel masterclass for triathletes just to get them to understand some of the foundations around how to actually fuel properly on the bike. So like talking about those fundamentals and those big rocks, people either under fuel the bike or maybe try and follow Sam and over fuel. But typically people like bonk or hit the wall, spend the whole rest of the day like useless on the couch. And you know, I just want to get people set up with some foundations to know like what sort of targets they should be aiming for to start with.

And then we can build on that. So if you want to check that out, I’m running it live on the 25th of October, 9 30 am Brisbane time. So Australian Eastern Standard Time. If you’re in the US or Canada, that’ll be your Tuesday night, the 24th. But go to bikefuel.co and you can see all the details and convert to whatever time zone you are in the world for that. Sounds good. Well, I’m sure there’s a lot of triathletes listening to this that could benefit from that. So we’ll make sure we include all these links on our podcast notes. I appreciate you being back on the podcast and perhaps early next year I’ll get you back on and see what’s happening in the world of nutrition and food or related to triathlon and related to swimming as well. So thank you very much for being on the podcast. Hi, you’re welcome anytime.